Why the Big Bang was the most precisely planned event in all of history

In your kitchen cabinet, you’ve probably got a spray bottle with an adjustable nozzle.  If you twist the nozzle one way, it sprays a spray_diego_torres_silvestrefine mist into the air. 

You twist the nozzle the other way, it squirts a jet of water in a straight line. 

You turn that nozzle to the exact position you want so you can wash a mirror, clean up a spill, or whatever.

If the universe had expanded a little faster, the matter would have sprayed out into space like fine mist from a water bottle – so fast, a gazillion particles of dust would speed into infinity and never even form a single star.If the universe had expanded just a little slower, the material would have dribbled out like big drops of water, then collapsed back where it came from by the force of gravity.

A little too fast, and you get a meaningless spray of fine dust.  A little too slow, and the whole universe collapses back into one big black hole.

The surprising thing is just how narrow the difference is – the fine tuning of the Big Bang. 

To strike the perfect balance between too fast and too slow, the force, something that physicists call “the Dark Energy Term” had to be accurate to one part in ten with 120 zeros. If you wrote this as a decimal, the number would look like this:

0.000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000000000000 0000000000000000000000000000001

In their paper “Disturbing Implications of a Cosmological Constant” two atheist scientists from Stanford University stated that the existence of this dark energy term would have required a miracle… “An unknown agent” intervened in cosmic history “for reasons of its own.”

Just for comparison, the best human engineering example is the Gravity Wave Telescope, which was built with a precision of 23 zeros. 

The Designer, the ‘external agent’ that caused our universe must possess an intellect, knowledge, creativity and power trillions and trillions of times greater than we humans have. Absolutely amazing.

Now a person who doesn’t believe in God has to find some way to explain this. 

One of the more common explanations seems to be “There was an infinite number of universes, so it was inevitable that things would have turned out right in at least one of them.”

The “infinite universes” theory is truly an amazing theory. Just think about it, if there is an infinite number of universes, then absolutely everything is not only possible… It’s actually happened!

It means that somewhere, in some dimension, there is a universe where the Chicago Cubs won the World Series last year.  There’s a universe where Justin Bieber becomes President of the United States. 

There’s even a universe where Elvis kicks his drug habit and still resides at Graceland and sings at concerts. 

Imagine the possibilities!

I might sound like I’m joking, but actually I’m dead serious. To believe an infinite number of universes made life possible by random chance is to believe everything else I just said, too.

Some people believe in God with a capital G.

And some folks believe in Chance with a Capital C.

Respectfully Submitted,

Perry Marshall

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312 Responses

  1. Geoff says:

    Science is atheistic in principle, since it looks for naturalistic explanations with no recourse to ‘higher’ forces.

    So the supreme being effect, if found, would become another force of nature.

    This is why I said ages ago, isn’t God supernatural, so why try and squeeze him into natural science? I think the anger comes from the assault on reason that most Intelligent Design (ID) is.

    As you say, the ‘religious science’ people cover a very broad range of thought. Sorry if I dumped you in with the nutcases!

    Anyway, I will read your references with interest. I have been reading a lot on particle physics and quantum mechanics, now that is very weird. The likelihood of the universe at all is pretty slim, that is the number 1 miracle.


    • Geoff,

      I fully understand that a lot of creationists seem nutty, or at least that their way of assessing what’s true is very very foreign to you. But not all are that way.

      Food for thought: I would encourage you to consider that science “got started” numerous times in history – ancient Greece, ancient Rome, Islam in the middle ages, ancient China, and Europe in the Middle Ages. Maybe even South America, maybe even Egypt. That’s 5 or 6 or 7 times.

      But it only KEPT going once, in Europe. And many historians (Rodney Stark and Stanley Jaki, to name a couple) argue quite persuasively that the difference between Europe and all the rest was its theology.

      The Europeans – Copernicus, Gallileo, Newton, etc – were starting with a theological assumption that the world was created by God and according to the Christian understanding of God, the universe was governed by unchangable laws which could be discovered.

      Wisdom of Solomon 11:21: “Thou hast ordered all things in measure and number and weight.” This was written 3000 years ago by Solomon. I believe that this scripture is what originally gave birth to modern science.

      The assumption was that to discover the universe is to discover underlying order. And to them, to discover those laws was also an act of worship, service to both God and man.

      So their theology, which is obviously external to science, led to a scientific hypothesis. This hypothesis proved to be correct, so correct that we completely take it for granted now. But remember, in the ancient world, such a hypothesis simply did not exist outside the Judeo-Christian worldview.

      Is science really atheistic? I say it’s not, because even though, as we say, science cannot detect the supernatural, science operates with assumptions that there is an external order imposed on the physical world. I am suggesting that the most successful science has always been compatible with a theological world view.

      Translating this into the Evolution vs. ID debate, neo-Darwinism assumes the driving force behind evolution is random mutation, an assertion that information theory proves to be wrong. My assertion is that evolution is an *engineered* process (as discussed by James Shapiro and other biologists) and that once again, an assumption of underlying order is the most productive assumption now as 500 years ago.


      Perry Marshall

      • Benjamin Bernier says:

        You are stating that the church is responsible for scientific knowledge? Come on!!

        • Benjamin,

          Where did I say that….?

          • Pete says:


            Wisdom of Solomon 11:21: “Thou hast ordered all things in measure and number and weight.” This was written 3000 years ago by Solomon. I believe that this scripture is what originally gave birth to modern science.

          • Tavi says:

            I think that the church is responsible for scientific knowledge INDIRECTLY; the ignorant people “created” God in the past, and the scientists try in the present time to validate the existence of God using the laws of physics and the mathematical formulas (Einstein, Hawking etc). The mythology created Icarus and Dedal and their wings from feather, the scientists created the pilots and the airplanes. The religion created Christ with his goodness and altruism for Mankind, the present civilization created the European Union and tomorrow maybe the World Union. I can’t imagine the evolution of any civilization, no matter how far in the depths of the Universe are… without the religion input. I don’t have problems calling God…God, or Hyper-Universe, or Multi-Dimensioning Universe… or E=MC2 . Do you want to see God? look around you, God is everywhere…close your eyes and look inside, God is there too. We are limited by our 5 senses so we see the Universe as a 3D Space plus the time, so to speak we see our evolution like “slices” day by day, but the religion assure us that there is more than we think it is – so it means that everything is already there just that we can’t perceive it yet, and I am sure that the science will validate that in the future, at the right time. Octavian

            • Embikay says:

              No problem. In my opinion, no sane, broad-minded, peace-loving, tolerant person would have problem agreeing with your sentiments/ thoughts/ convictions as expressed here. One might in a hurry quarrel with your use of words like “the church/ ignorant men created …..”, but your observations demand a deeper look, which a saner person is always game for. Thanks. Regards.

            • Forrest Charnock says:

              Dear Tavi:

              The people who gave up powered flight, as well as modern rocketry and spavr travel from Otto Lilienthal and the Wright Brothers to Goddard and von Braun were all conservative Christians, creationists.

              • Tavi says:

                Dear Forrest Charnock,

                The people who gave up powered flight were all conservative Christians, creationists? You mentioned Wright Brothers, Lilienthal etc, what about the Romanians like Aurel Vlaicu who built in 1912 the first all-metal airplane in the World that could fly? Or the Romanian engineer Coanda who invented the jet engine (you know the well known Coanda effect) so we can fly faster the sound everywhere? Etc, etc… and as a Romanian born I am proud of all of these. There is no doubt that people like them made and continue to make our lives easier, better…still flying with mechanical devices won’t get us far enough, not even if we’d use the photonic powered engines. With our minds we could get in an instant everywhere, and not only in this 3D Universe but even beyond it, into hyper dimensions, deeper in the God’s consciousness. I believe that more and more people are aware of all of this, and I believe the knowledge is seeded in our genes and it will be discovered at the right time. Once we acquire more than five senses, we will discover things beyond our imagination… at an exponential power; I believe this is what Jesus tried to tell us in a way that could be understood not only by that society from his time, but our society or the future one too. Science without Religion would change us in Super Robots…and I am sure that this won’t be the Mankind’s future path. Einstein believed in God, and he was not a millionaire like Clark Gable, Frank Sinatra etc and although he was the greatest mind of the XXst century he had a monthly paycheck like you and me, like most of us. Microsoft’s genius Bill Gates is willing to help Africa with his fortune because his great love for Mankind, how can we not admire people like him? And yes, though he is using “robots” in his home … he is so human, though it appears he is from a different World…mmmm 🙂
                Here is an experience I had using my mind: http://mindscape777.blogspot.com and here are some Art Work I created after that, just open the Pic folder: http://www.myspace.com/octavian7 have an awesome life, Tavi (Octavian)

                • Forrest Charnock says:

                  Dear Tavi:

                  What is your point about Coanda? What were his beliefs?
                  He was certainly a great scientist and he put the thermodynamics of god fearing men like Lord Kelvin to great use with jet engines.

                  He also used his God given genius in the offshore technology sector and created new materials for architecture.

                  He did not found any major branch of science or any of its laws so again ,what is your point?

                  The Coanda effect is something God created and Coanda explained.


                  Being a philanthropist is a wonderful thing but I am a whole lot more impressed with a poor person who digs there change out of their pocket to help someone that a person who had billions giving some away. I also will note that only people with humanistic beliefs are praised by the media.
                  The people at the Salvation Army get paid nothing , that impresses me.

                  Dick Cheney gave away 75% of his yearly income a few years back and he is hated .

                  We are all going to die. It is good to be charitable, Christ commanded us to be so. It is much more important what happens to your eternal soul.

                  As far as your paranormal experience lots of people have them. Lots of people experience being taken onto spacecraft and probed. I believe it really happened to them, I just don’t believe the “aliens” were mortal beings.
                  One advantage of believing the Bible is you need not worry about “alien” abduction, it has never happened to a conservative Christian.

                  People hear voices telling them to commit murder, I also believe that actually happens. It never happens to those who trust God’s word.

                  Every poll ever done shows evolutionists are at least 300% more likely to believe in little green men and visit fortune tellers.

                  • Tavi says:

                    Dear Forrest Charnock,

                    What is my point about Coanda? Well he was born Romanian like me and you mentioned all the other guys but him… and Coanda is the inventor of the jet aircraft (1910), and I’m kinda proud of it. The sound barrier could not be broken in the propeller driven plane, so his jet engine was (is) really impressive; I guess next would be the light barrier to be broken 🙂 … Coanda was a Romanian Christian Orthodox.

                    You are right that many people had/have paranormal experiences, and I guess someday in the future all humans will be able “to walk on water” at will, like it was done 2000 years ago. Think about Shirley MacLaine’s experience from her book “Out on a Limb”, I mean she was in Peru with David in a truck and he drove the truck on that dangerous mountain winding road with his eyes closed and without touching the steering wheel… Does this experience have the “Finger of God” embedded on it, or it is the work of an alien super civilization? Anyway, when I read about it for the first time it really overwhelmed me, and I am not that kind of guy who can be impressed so easy. I do believe that there is an unseen matrix that links together our subconscious mind and we “know” if what we read or hear is true or not. I just believe that those “miracles” from the Bible or/and “Out on a Limb” are true!

                    I believe in “memory cell”, and that being said because the copulation act the exchange of fluids and the osmosis process, the “information and experiences” from one individual is transmitted to the other one, in other words if my ancestral sequence branch goes as far as 2000 years ago to those people that witnessed live Christ’s miracles then I will believe in Jesus no matter what. So if I am right it means that the past life regressions are actually the memory cells info that was acquired through the osmosis process of the copulation act (and not necessary the result of pregnancy outcome) from ancestral time, instead of thinking that our Souls are reincarnated life after life. This could explain why many people believe that they were Cleopatra or Cesar or etc in their past lives. In the distant future we all might become “One” because the osmosis process I explained above. I also believe in a “mental” osmosis that is capable of transmitting that info via the subconscious mind Matrix if certain “gates” are open (I guess most of us keep those gates close), speeding the humans process of becoming “One”. Well, this is my personal belief.

            • Forrest Charnock says:

              Dear Tavi:

              The people who gave up powered flight, as well as modern rocketry and spacr travel from Otto Lilienthal and the Wright Brothers to Goddard and von Braun were all conservative Christians, creationists.

            • Forrest Charnock says:

              Dear Tavi:

              I would like to see your evidence that people who believed in God in the past were ignorant, I would like you to see your evidence people were less intelligent in the past period.
              Unless you can show how stupid people designed and built the Pyramids and set up the rocks on Easter Island and computed the movement of the heavens within the margin of error of modern supercomputers I would have to say you are practicing chronological snobbery.

              Atheism requires evolution and millions of years to believe and the idea humans were once apes and are constantly evolving into superior creatures is a purely atheistic assumption that has no basis in fact, it contradicts the evidence.

              People have always believed in God and mono-theism predates polytheism . What you are practicing is pantheism. God is a being, not a thought. We should seek a personal relationship with our creator , not some mystic experience you speak of.

              You seem to be a big fan of the European Union and that is fine but you seem to have completely missed the greatest gift to come out of Europe which is the rise of Western logic and science that flourished in Christian ,Post-Reformation Europe .

              Scientists do not create pilots and one cell of the scientist is beyong human imagination in complexity. Where is the logic in praising an invention like an airplane which does not even rate as a child’s toy next to a single cell of the hands that built them and writing off the creation of that hand to blind chance? It would be logically consistent to believe a tornado in a junkyard could form a 747.
              The 747 is a sick joke compared to just one of the trillions of cells in your body.

              Energy equals mass times velocity squared is a scientific formula that has no relationship to the creation of the universe. It is a way of measuring in our universe.
              The idea of multiple universes is the dumbest idea in the history of science and as blind a religious belief as one could make up. I find it odd a person who without the slightest evidence calls the ancients stupid people who made up God turns around and creates imaginary universes and presents them as God, that is nothing short of bizarre, no offense.

              By your logic you are smarter than your grandparents just because you were born later.

              • Tavi says:

                Hi Forrest Charnock

                How stupid people designed and built the Pyramids? I am not sure how they did it, we still try to understand the way they built the Pyramids and there are several theories out there about it. For the same token there are some theories about how the huge Nazca Peru Spider was created, etc. As I said previously I believe also in a “mental” osmosis that is capable of transmitting and perceiving information via the subconscious mind Matrix if certain “gates” are open, so those who built the Pyramids “were told” sub-consciously how to do it; By whom? I am not sure, by the Universal Intelligence, by God… Even in the Bible is written that if you ask you’ll get the answer, and if you knock then the doors will be open for you. If you read Homer’s Iliad you realize that the heroes were kinda stupid and they didn’t have reasoning at all, they were told by the Gods what to do and how to do it. Odysseus was told by the goddess Athena to build the Trojan horse and how to build it, Paris was told by Aphrodite to aim Achilles’ heel, etc, etc. I believe in One Super Dimension of Space that is projected on its sub-dimensions, therefore as long as we perceive only five senses and 4 dimensions we will never be able to create miracles. I believe that Christ was able to create miracles because He perceived more than 4 dimensions and more than 5 senses.

                To answer your question “I would like to see your evidence that people who believed in God in the past were ignorant”, well 10000 years ago ended the Ice Age, 5000 years ago were built the Pyramids, 500 years ago Giordano Bruno was burned at the stake by ignorant people who believed in God.

            • Forrest Charnock says:

              Also Tavi please understand that all the laws of physics and all the major branches of science were founded on the assumption of the existence of the God of the bible so when you try to separate science from those who believe in God you have seperated science,from science.

              Even atheist philosophers of science realize this and that the advance of science was only possible because of Christianity.

              If you stop and think about it doing experiments is pretty stupid if everything happens by chance .

              Laws do not evolve, they are created by a Law Giver.

              • Tavi says:

                Dear Forrest Charnock,
                As I said previously I believe also in a “mental” osmosis that is capable of transmitting and perceiving information via subconscious mind matrix if certain “gates” are open, so those who built the Pyramids a long time ago “were told sub-consciously” by the Universal Intelligence, or by God… how to do it. The Euclidean geometry and the Pythagorean formals were discovered much later, so in the past even if the humans were ignorant still they were able to create wonderful things that impress us even now. As I said before this is my personal belief, and the only thing that I want to add to my previous messages to you is that those “ignorant people who believed in God” and let Giordano Bruno burn at the stake… were actually atheists in disguised avid for money and power…; we know from history and Bible that a true Christian would not do such kind of things. We know that the Christians from Jesus Christ’s time would rather let themselves be killed in the Roman’s arenas than hold the sword fight and kill other human beings. What I am trying to say is that I walk on the same side of the road with you…

        • Tavi says:

          Benjamin, you said “The church is responsible for scientific knowledge?” You already know the answer like so many others!… I am sure that the creation of the Bible was not intended to replace the library of Alexandria, or to speak about Jules Verne and his intentions to send the man on the Moon using a big
          Columbiad Cannon, or the fact that the “beautiful” planet Venus has the “Hell” on its surface.

          The Bible spoke about Jesus, who was not a prophet, He was by far more than that because He perceived more than five senses and more than 4 dimensions, therefore He was able to do miracles; His miracles witnessed by so many from his time attest that, and if everything was a lie then we wouldn’t hear of Jesus centuries after centuries, like we do not hear about other so called “prophets” from his time.

          In the Genesis was written that the Creation was done in 7 days in order to be understood by those people from that society. For the same token Jesus with His inner beauty appeared in that era on Earth to show posterity the future of mankind inner beauty and its awesome evolution to perfection. Science without religion would change us slowly into Super Robots…but this will never happen because “The Finger” of God is imprinted in our DNA. “The Finger” of God is imprinted everywhere in the Cosmos, “The Finger” of God was found as the cosmic microwave background radiation that confirmed the Big Bang. In my mind the Big Bang does not mean “the big explosion”, like a grenade would explode and sends the matter allover. The Big Bang means that the Universe suddenly appeared stationary to dimensions bigger than we already now it is, like an projection from beyond of our time and space that already had the seeds of the Galaxies formation, and after the Big Bang the “fabric” of space started to inflate itself, making the distance between the Galaxies bigger and bigger. The Big Bang would be more like someone would leave, suddenly, a footprint on the sand on the sea shore with his foot, and then the wind or rain or waves would change its shape. It would be easer for us to understand how our Universe was created if we consider God as one Super Dimension that is projected exponentially on its sub-dimensions. I created some artworks that emphasize our hyper-dimensional origin http://www.myspace.com/octavian7

      • Zippy Karakurt Ozman says:

        Perry, this is my first question to you directly…….

        Does believing in parallel universes contradict theology?

        Steven Hawkins, who was born just 300 years after Galileo’s death, ( January 8, 1942) explains his theories in a simple manner so that people like me -with no scientific background and no knowledge of simple physics) can understand to a certain degree, the rules of our universe.

        According to S.H. quantoum mechanics gives us infinite possibilities. He is trying to find out, if there are wormholes between those parallel universes, he is not sure whether the same physical and chemical rules apply to the infinite parallel universes…….. As I understand, in our own modest!!!! (hahahaha)universe there are infinite possibilites. Do you agree with this theory?

        My understanding is this…… God Has a business to run…….. His business is to organise the universes, and their physical and chemical rules. He is a very busy Man.

        He knows the importance of family life, so He creates the mother nature and lets her to multiply. Some ladies are fertile so that they multiply His family in large numbers…. some ladies are sterile.

        When He is satisfied with the development of His young families , He starts educating them.

        You may find my explanation childish, and I cannot blame you. I am a childish woman when the science is concerned. I am also a funny lady. My brain works much much much more affective when there is a joke. I love God’s sense of humour.

        My favourite joke of His is……. we humans were thinking not so long ago that, we were the centre of universe…….. Isn’t it great??????

        Perry, I love your technics in explaining the complex physical matters and I laugh a lot with your jokes. Please feel free to correct my elemantary mistakes both in science and in English. I would only be grateful to you for your help.

        I lost my husband in 1994. He was my first sweetheart, he was my private tutor of physics….. The joke was, I never learned the theoretical physics from him, but I learned the practice. hohohohoho……… I met him in 1964 when I was 15-16 and he was 22…… He was a student to become a civil engineer…….

        I am still hopeful that if quantoum mechanics gives me multiple choices, I would like to play my role with Giray quite differently……. I got married in 1970. I would like to change the practice of my life, starting from the 1970’s……. Is this possible? here is the 60,000 USD. question?

        Thanks a lot for your valuable time.


        • Zippy,

          All kinds of ideas have been made of the ideas in quantum mechanics. There is the movie “What the Bleep do we know” which makes it sound as though you can create reality by imagining it.

          I have never found these arguments convincing.

          So far as I can tell, we live one life and quantum mechanics doesn’t give us a chance to live two…. doesn’t give us direct knowledge of parallel universes, even if they do exist.

          Sorry to hear of the passing of your husband. Sounds like you guys had a great relationship.


          • Zippy Karakurt Ozman says:

            Thanks a lot for your reply Perry. Yes indeed we had great time together, although
            we were cut short. He and I had been through some extra ordinary experiences and since his demise, I have been going through those experiences on my own.

            I find your website as an excellent spot to discuss my experiences. Your interpretation of my experiences with your mathematical and analytical brain could be fruitful. I am not going to discuss them yet, since my personal experiences might be too philosophical for a technical site as yours.

            However, I am trying to absorb your teachings about DNA codes. I find them most satisfactory. I have to tell you my own experience with computers…….. My first purchase was in 1995, an apricot machine with windows 95 on it. I took my computer home and started hating it…… It was like having a Rolls Royce in my garage, without a driving licence……. I found a private tutor, and I did not like his technics in teaching. He was too intensive with his methods of teaching and he was harming my ego badly….. He could not understand that I am a capricious student. Hohohohoho…..

            I think four letter alphabet of DNA genetic codes refer to four directions……North, South, East and West…… I was born in the East. I learned handwriting first, then I took some courses to learn methodic typing (never learned short hands) I used to be fast on Turkish keyboard. I once even got a reward for my fast typing. I always liked typing…… and developed a kind of gestures…… when I get excited I start typing the subject with my fingers. People used to ask me what I was doing with my fingers…… since I do this without a type-writer at hand. At present I am enjoying my computer as a word processor…… I love it, because I can correct my mistakes before sending my messages or print out my texts, just like DNA error correction and error checking mechanisms……… When I was using my type-writer, a single mistake would cost me the whole page…….. Too many wasted papers……..

            It is interesting to see that in the East ( in Mesopotamia) the early civilisations learned to leave their marks with tablets, then scriptures, then copying the typed books and printing and on the 7th day having the computer. It is an interesting journey for the word of God from East to West, isn’t it?

            Now you are telling us that DNA code is based exactly on the same system as computers work…….this means each of US come to life with a map drawn in our handpalms and the wiser we get, the easier it becomes to see our past and future scribbled in our map.

            If it is not asking for too much, could you please tell me the 11 dimensions of Einstein. In fact, I think I know the first half a dozen of them…… Height, length, width, time, cause and affect, thinking………… I would be most grateful if you could answer to my request.

            Thank you so much for your time…….

            P.S. I have just listened to Dr. Hugh Ross, and I am happy to learn that Bing Bang theory and quantoum mechanics actually support Jesus Christ and His Teachings……. I totally agree with Bing Bang = Jesus Christ……..This equation made my day, since I have been feeling this equation for a while, yet I was not able to prove due to my lack of knowledge of Bible and Physics……. Thank you once more for this fantastic site.

      • CJ says:

        Perry I have to say I was not sure which side of the argument you were coming from initially, but you are way off. Why is our human inability to explain something or find a root cause reason in itself to assign its creation or cause to a diety? I find very little talk on your site about some of the most groundbreaking theories of the multiverse, and that the “big bang” was more likely a series of big bangs that have occurred for trillions of years into internity. As for your assertion that the universe was created just as it should be for life to exist on Earth, and other planets I believe as well is also flawed, as I believe it was Hawking who said that if the Universe had developed in any other way, with even slightly different physical or chemical laws, that we would not be here to question it. I believe what Hawking was stating suggests that there HAVE BEEN countless previous universes, each with their own physical laws and other features that would not necessarily have been at all like our own. More to come, I enjoy the discussion, and hopefully enlightening you theists a little more.

        • An eternal past regression of universes is impossible because of entropy. There is only a finite amount of energy, it is being used up, and there is no reset button.

          As for what Hawking was suggesting, maybe you could read him closer and see what he was really saying. One thing is for sure: Hawking is no atheist.

      • norman50 says:

        okay..okay..god exist but is it true about that 2012 comet???

    • Venugopal says:

      I have not come across a chapter on God, either the Existance of God or the non-existance of God, in any basic text book of physical sciences – physics, chemistry or Mathematics. It is not in the ambit of basic science to theorise about God, it is as simple as that. Some scientific writers will try to fit into the frame of science, their own personal beliefs, which really is not a correct thing. Science, being one of the most marvelous product of the human intellect, is not the be all and end all of life. It is only one among many human activities. For most people religion is more important than science. Then there are millions of people who devote their lives for art6, dance, music, literature etc. We cannot say one is superior than the other. Each has its own place in human life. IMHO it is a wise thing not to attempt to prove the existance or non-existance of God through science.

      • Forrest Charnock says:

        Dear Venugopal :

        You made the statement “I have not come across a chapter on God, either the Existance of God or the non-existance of God, in any basic text book of physical sciences ” .

        Read “In the Beginning was Information by Dr. Werner Gitt .
        It is sad so many hold man’s fallible ideas as superior to the word of infallible God.
        The only source of information known to science is intelligence therefore the source of genetic information is supernatural intelligence as that information had to pre-exist life. Science never proves anything really but the existence of God is a very sound scientific conclusion.

        • Joseph Bhartiya says:

          i cannot agree more with friend Forrest, for in the Quran God’s first words to mankind are Iqra bisme Rabbi kallazi khalaq_ _ _ _”READ in the name of your Lord who teacheth by the Pen,teacheth man what he knew not_ _ _”.INother words nothing in God’s creation is random or haphazard.From the smallest germ or bacterium to the largest i.e. the Universe he has a well designed blue-print.This whole argument about Creationism v/s Evolutionism is so much wind,and those who know Him even little,who honor Him and thank Him for the smallest gift know that He and only He deserves to be loved and worshipped.Believe me i am 65 and i too started as an atheist.But being a seeker saved me,for His only condition to grant Enlightenment is drop your Ego your superiority,come to ME childlike,vulnerable and I shall make you whole in body mind and spirit. .

    • Forrest Charnock says:

      Science does not rule out God, scientist do.
      I find it very telling that evolutionists have a whole field of study to prove evolution is true because God would not have used this design or that. It even has a name,
      Dysteleology. The church is where Darwin found initial support, the French were against him for years and Cambridge would not allow his book in their library for over a decade. Anyone who thinks science welcomed Darwin with open arms is mistaken badly.
      As far as science even atheist philosophers of science like Eisley agree it flourished because of Christianity. In a chaotic world there is no reason to suspect order . All scientist must borrow from that worldview to do science, to think at all.

    • Cristiano says:

      Geoff, note that what we call science today would look miraculous to people from past generations. Who could imagine in the 1700s that someday you would the world in a matter of hours, or look at the skies to see worlds without number, or find cure for diseases that spread terror at that time in history? What they called “supernatural” is perfectly explained, demonstrated and controlled in our modern science. And what you call “supernatural” today, or “religious science”, will be, in the near future, comprehensible and controllable.

      What separates most religions from science is the belief that “God” is a “substance” that “fills the entire space” with “no passions” or body, incomprehensible and unattainable. Though this is the most widespread belief it is NOT true. God is in every sense of the word a Man, possessing a physical body, though more “refined”, immortal, comprehending all things, and possessing all power, but personal; His physical body can be touched and felt. He can control all things by the word of His power, being literally the Father of human race, since the first man and woman did not evolved from lesser races, but were born of Him and set upon this earth to care for the creation of His hands. Though He is the Creator of worlds without number populated with billions and billions of His offspring, He is not a distant Being but a very personal one, knowing our names and caring for us individually.

      The religions of the world lost sight of what is our purpose here stating that the purpose of our creation is to be raised from the dead to enter in the presence of God to worship him forevermore in a state of no marriage or family relationship, of no increase in knowledge or glory, to be had as servants of Him who created us.” Such theory is totally WRONG. We were not created to be servants, but to inherit the same measure of power and glory that He possess and to enter into Exaltation and become as He is Gods and Creators, to populate our own Creations and exalt our own children in the everlasting heavens.

      When someone says that Christianity is a shadow of lesser and older cults they totally miss the point since all cults have their origin in the doctrines and practices that led to Christianity. Being the sacrifices they offered a gift of restitution to their Gods in the same pattern as Adam offered sacrifices to his God. Their cults of Demigods a ressemblance of the true miraculous birth of Christ, being he a son of a God and a woman. All other ressemblances in ancient miths and cults are derived from the first teachings given to the first man Adam when he was taught by Holy Angels and by the Creator himself and saw the visions of eternity and taught his children to worship the only Living God.

      The centuries alway from a true belief in such a personall God has dumped the religions of the world in such a way as to make them of no worth, save in making men more pious, patient and humble. In ancient time God spoke through chosen man, Prophets, who born record of His existence and attributes since they knew Him personally, having seen His face and partaking constantly of His presence, having had opened to their eyes the visions of eternity and the glories ahead, and seeing the future events that would take place in this earth, having seen the Creations of His hands, worlds without numbers, and gazed upon the everlasting majesty of His dominions. Having such perfect knowledge they could boldly and solenmly testify of things they did know about.

      Today is not different, there are living Witnesses upon the earth, called of God, in the fullness of times, to bear solenm witness of His mercy and attributes and to help in bringing to pass His work and glory. These men are Apostles, Special Witnesses, Prophets, Seers and Revelators, with power and authority endowed upon them to testify of the same message. God did not change, only men did.

      • alyssa says:

        dear cristiano

        i will disagree with you on an important point.
        and also answer your writings to i

        i do not believe that God created us for the purpose of making us demigods or for making us like him. we as individuals and as a whole will never be Him.
        we are the creation. we are not The Creator.
        we Are creators, definitely.

        my post about the multifaceted religions on the planet (and nonreligions) is as such — i Do believe that it is possible for two different people or peoples to turn to God and get different answers. Yes. Why?
        because just as we are multifasceted individuals, and if i ask God simply what i should wear today, He will answer me differently in the future or past or even at a different time.
        we as the human race are here for a purpose, i believe.
        and so, when a muslim asks what he should do, he recieves a different answer than a jew or christian (if we are to focus on the three abrahamic religions that i personally am most familiar with)
        that is not to excuse one who does not adhere to the religion, or who hates his fellows in his heart or with his hand…

        and so yes, i do believe that it is all perfect, that everyone is doing what they must, and that if this chapter of our history ends in a brutal war, than the right men and women for God will win; that it will all be perfect, and all is sort of perfect right now already.
        we are all fighting Gods fight, there is no other; we are merely debating which taste is best, and the way to find out how to move forward is through struggle – where we find ourselves now.

        according to ancient jewish sources, a reason for the creation of the world is ‘so that God could create a dwelling place in the lower worlds’
        and/or ‘ so that God could have a creature to which he could give to ‘

        both beautiful in my eyes. yet there are no right answers, especially for that huge cosmic answer, that could possibly fit into the limiting language of words anyway.
        God Bless

    • malik says:

      the big bang was not planned at all because it occured on its own and no one knows how , we all just speculating .

      • robert says:

        Dear malik, if it’s not planned, then it will never happen, and if it never happen then we wouldn’t be here at all….. wallah! that’s what it is as far as mr perry argument is concern by my understanding.

    • Venugopal says:

      The following site provides very convincing arguments that there never was any big Bang :
      “The fingers of God Point to No Big Bang”.

    • Martin Armenta says:

      So are you saying is like ‘The planet of the Apes?’ kind of theory? That in the tenth, millionth of a possivility galaxy there’s another earth that they’re living in out present time but diffrently?

  2. Eugene says:

    I believe that god is an “unknown external agent”, but not an old man with a beard and human feelings as believed by the mosaic religions (YHVH). I do not believe in the random paradigm of supposed atheistic people.

    • peter coch says:

      Oh my Eugene! If you truly believe that us Messianics think that about YHVH, you obviously stand with the Pharisees who ‘Jesus’ accused of not knowing ‘Moses’. The number of Israeli believers in Yashua Messiach recently become the majority in that country. Think again bokkie and catch up before you make statements. Many Christians still believe that the sign of Jonah was possible over the Easter weekend and that justifies breaking the 4th Commandment. It is this kind of thinking that will lead to 2Thes2v3

    • Tavi says:

      Hi Eugene,

      You believe that God is an “unknown external agent”? God is everything; don’t make God a lesser God, like the matter is external and God the organizer. Do you want to see God? Look around you, God is everywhere, close your eyes and look inside…God is there too. There is a reason you perceive only 5 senses, if you add one more dimension to the space and time, you would be able the see the beginning and the end of you and everything in between at once. The scientists already did a pseudo- “prototype” of a cube in a hyper dimensional state and they even added mathematical equations to it, they named it Tesseract or Octachoron. Think about the projection of a cube on a flat plane as being a square, imagine you live in a flat world and you are familiar with the squares, your intuition tells you that there is another dimension besides width and length that goes up and you name it height, then you try to visualize that world….you discover you can jump and see farther than the tip of your nose, not going slice by slice to the destination. Imagine our 3D space is being the projection of a hyper dimension, like your shadow is the projection of your body on a flat surface; try to feel that hyper dimension(s), can you see the beginning and the end of you and everything in between at once? There are people who can feel it just meditating, others using the mathematical equations. We, and everything around us, are an intrinsic part of God, nothing is external. If God is infinite than there are infinite blessings and infinite tragedies…which part of the infinite do you want to perceive? The Bible and other sacred books give us the answer…we want infinite blessings, we are told to choose that; the sword using the name of God will bring you only tragedies; The altruism, goodness bring you friendship. I think the religion is the soul and the science is the tool to implement, to navigate to the destination. In the future the religion will become more sofisticated to match the intelect of that society, and maybe it will have a different name…more sofisticated, still it will always show us the the right highways to the infinite blessings and less and less people will choose the opposite… because hey, God is infinite.

  3. N.Manohara Murthy says:

    Dear Prof. Perry Marshall,
    Our Universe is created due to Big Bang as per the established experimental observations.You have referred to the concept of infinite universes. String theory envisages multi universe concept.In such a cosmos universes are being created and destroyed. According to principle of detailed balance when one universe is created another some where in the cosmos ( Wider sense ) would have got destroyed. If we consider this phenomenon as prevailing in the cosmos ,then, on a dynamical scale a steady state cosmos exists.This steady state cosmos where in universes are being created and destroyed is knowsn as Brahma Padatrtha according to Hindu Philosophy.Perhaps Einstein may be considered to be correct with respect to the cosmos containing multiuniverses unless the laws of Physics have different form in different universes. May I have your comment on this.?

    • It may be possible that there are other universes. However it is by definition impossible for us to detect them, and to invoke them as a means of explaining the “luckiness” of our own universe brings unwarranted complexity to the theory.

      • Pete says:

        I would like to counter your statement here by using your own words. If I may …

        “However it is by definition impossible for us to detect them, and to invoke them as a means of explaining the “luckiness” of our own universe brings unwarranted complexity to the theory. ”

        Replacing the references to multiuniverses with God aren’t I making an equally valid statement?

        However God is by definition impossible for us to detect….

        Furthermore in a discussion of theory when is an intelligent response or counterpoint unwarranted complexity?

        • Pete,

          I appreciate your questions and your sincerity. I have an answer to a very similar question here: http://evo2.org/existence-of-god/comment-page-2/#comment-255


          • Syed Waqar says:

            Dear Mr. Perry,

            God is not like a body which has hand or physical. It is the intelligent system and we are unable to explain the parameters of that system. For instance animals would never able to understand what is going in NASA and what are the missions of Space Shuttle, how the supper comuter works.

            Suppose the dog with NASA engineer who remain with the engineer most of the time, that dog would never able to understand what his master doing in NASA becuse it is beyond the parameters of dog mind. This is fact.

            I understand from our past that the great scientists of all time have equal ability and posses specific identity in that time. Newton, Einstien have the same quality of mind and their creative work has its worth. Einstien could not build the SR & GR if he has no knowledge of Newton.

            Related to topic of Big bang. There was no big bang but the Universe created at all points at the same time not at one point.

            To my understanding before the creation of this Universe there was bang but not at one place at all places.

            The state before the bang was like “About to Creat Universe” If the energy at certain point raised in space to certain level, it will create matter.

            For example in high energy physics W & Z, intermediate vector bosons were created by the collission of high speed particles. That is because that the energy at certain point raised beyond that certain level and that high energy is responsible and has created the heavy particles. The lighter particles attain high kinetic energy and when collided with stationary particle the energy at certain point in space, raised and that pass the barrior and mass was created.

            Simillarly the before the big bang, energy started increasing every where and at all the point where the energy increased to certain limits mass was created in that location and i call many bangs not one big bang.

            Please comment,

            Best regards,

            Syed Waqar
            Islamabad Pakistan.

    • Forrest Charnock says:

      Dear N.Manohara Murthy:

      The Big Bang is a story to explain the evidence , it is not an observation. There are many thousands of scientists from atheists to conservative Christians who see it as poor science. It is very popular , but so was bloodletting at one time.

    • Dina says:

      Of course the laws of Physics have different form in different universes, and not only the laws of Physics. All other laws as well. Why? Because they have other sun (may be more than one), other cosmic radiance and so on…

  4. Venugopal says:

    The Big Bang took place around 15 Billion years ago. There are Galaxies which are 30 billion years old. Please explain this discrepency if you can.

    • There are no galaxies that are 30 billion years old, not sure where that information came from.

      • Venugopal says:

        From : http://newuniversetheory.com/06_milestone_bar_chart.htm
        The ‘Time-Line Bar Chart’ shows the universe has existed for a time longer than ~30 billion years.
        Please also read this informative article :
        From : http://news.softpedia.com/news/To-Bang-or-not-to-Bang-15095.shtml
        “To Bang or not to Bang ?”
        From : http://www.etheric.com/Cosmology/redshift.html
        “Evidence against the expanding universe hypothesis”

        • Cristiano says:

          Dear Venugopal,

          The point here is not to prove the exact date the Big Bang occurred or even if it has occurred or not, but in effect it is to prove that all discoveries done by science show and prove that there must be an acting Force, or Power, or Being, behind the existence of all that is visible or not. I looked at the sites you quoted and they are as much theory as any other, there is no actual proof of such affirmatives and you cannot affirm that what has been show by Perry is contrary to something that someone else said and that may be as far from the truth as we can think of.

          Having analysed the matter it becomes clear to me that there is no mistake or confusion in what has been stated until now by Mr. Perry and of such things I undersign my approval as one who is also passioned by true science and who can testify of the existence of a Creator of worlds without number.

  5. prabesh says:

    dear Prof. Perry Marshall,
    from this part, you seem to tell that every event has a dimension of it’s own. i’d like to know if each and every aspects of our lifetime activities have their own dimension and can we access them if we have a time machine or so ?

  6. Tavi says:

    Hi Perry,

    About your statement: “If the universe had expanded a little faster, the
    matter would have sprayed out into space like fine
    mist from a water bottle – so fast that a gazillion
    particles of dust would speed into infinity and never even
    form a single star.”

    According to science the Universe did not expand…it inflated and that’s a huge difference. By the way the seeds of the Galaxies were created prior to the Big Bang so the matter was already in the right shape (that was proved). In the first trillion of a second the Universe was already bigger than we know it now (and the distance between the seeds of the Galaxies formation were inflated at that time, the galaxies were stationary, think about some dots you draw on a baloon then you inflate it, the distance between the dots will increase). What was before the Singularity (the dot without dimenssions that has an infinite mass…sounds like a SF story…though it is posible)? … think about it, it is so easy (I am not reffering to myths, I am talking about scince).
    Although I liked your privious two emails about “Where did the Universe Come from?” …this email (the 3rd one) was a disapointment.
    I wonder what I will read in your tomorrow email “I can prove to you that God exists”? …

    And yes I believe in God with a capital G, and yes Jesus Christ is a miracle, think about his goodness at that time when the World was populated by barbarians… including the Romans (though they recited poems). I do not need to see Christ walking on water, the true miracle is His goodness and love for mankind that no man matched it since then on…

    Good luck
    Tavi 🙂

    • Richard says:

      Hi Tavi,

      I can write a story about a man or woman that surpassed Christ goodness, and three thousands years from now it will be as impossible for any man or woman to match it. Will that make it true.

      I am also waiting and smiling for tomorrow proof. Once he proved that god exist I can send him after god to obtain a solution for better world. Or with all the powers god have, is that the best world god can think of. Or was part of humanity a mistake god need to fix. Just want to talk god, and question God intention.

      • Tavi says:

        Hi Richard,

        I believe that it is writen in the Bible that Jesus said once to his disciples that any of them can do things like Him…if they choose so. I am sure that He could impose “by force” the ultimate goodness in any of us…but then there wouldn’t be things like “free choice”. Are you waiting and smiling for tomorrow proof…once he proved that God exists? I am redundent, I already wrote somewhere in here with my European “accent”….still here you are, I believe that the ignorant people “created” God in the past for that time for that society because the information was already coded in our genes, and the scientists try in the present time to validate the existence of God using the laws of physics and the mathematical formulas (Einstein, Hawking etc). The mythology created Icarus and Dedal and their wings from feather, the scientists created the pilots and the airplanes. The religion created Christ with his goodness and altruism for Mankind, the present civilization created the European Union and tomorrow maybe the World Union. I can’t imagine the evolution of any civilization, no matter how far in the depths of the Universe are… without the religion input. I don’t have problems calling God…God, or Hyper-Universe, or Multi-Dimensioning Universe… or E=MC2 . As I said do you want to see God, then look around you, close your eyes and look inside…God is there too. Yes you can write a story about a woman or a man that surpassed Christ goodness…. I am not sure if one billion people or so would remember your name…I am not sure why…it must be something I am missing , 🙂

        • Richard says:

          Hi Tavi,

          😉 WOW, the European Union well I am not that impressed, if you look at the world history they were many Empires which were larger than that so its really nothing new. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_empires. Even the Soviet Union was bigger than it. World Union hmmm sound impressive.

          So if its free choice why do Jesus want u to do thing his way, its sound more like his choice to me. For the right price I will tell you what we need.

          I just look into look in my head, and there are so many gods, Christian God, Muslin God, Judaism God, Voodoo God, Egyptian Gods, Hindu Gods, Greek Gods and many more even a god who do not exist an Atheist god with a small g. Now which one do you think should be there so I can ignore the rest.

          Well u just remember my name, and why do I need a billion when 6 billion already know my name.
          Go and ask everyone you know if they ever head of the name Rich or Richard.

          • Tavi says:

            “If you look at the world history they were many Empires which were larger than that?” Hmmmm, first of all European Union is not an Empire and it was not created by the sword. In the European Union case all the countries try the best they can to be accepted in. In those empires you were talking about all the nations were ripped off and oppressed… and yes the Soviet Union Empire ripped off all those countries behind the Iron Curtain until late 80’s. In the European Union the new accepted countries get billions of Euros in help to get to the same level like the other industrialized countries. By the way I heard that Israel and India would love to get in the Union too. Hey I am not sure if you really believe everything you wrote…

            “You look into your head and there are so many Gods?” I assume that you do not believe in Einstein, Hawking and others either… or maybe yes, you believe in the Big Bang theory and that dimensionless dot with an infinite mass that was the source of the Big Bang. You know that a dimensionless dot exist only in geometry, not in reality… so that infinite mass that suddenly populated the universe has to come from somewhere, and the only place is from a hyper dimensioning place that most of us name it God, this does not mean that God is “That There” and we are here, nope God is everything just that our 5 senses can’t perceive more than that, a blind person can’t even dare to imagine what you actually see with your opened eyes, you get my point. The concept of God in antiquity was perfect for that society, you know that and I hope you didn’t think a moment that any of these people who wrote messages in here is an idiot, religious extremist and personify God like Michelangelo did it on the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel, or the Greeks with Zeus etc.

            Except in England the name Rich or Richard is not use anywhere, not in France, Italy, Spain, Greece etc, Japan, China etc … maybe in Russia, I am not sure, maybe you tell me. Ah it is use in the states, in all 50, but then driving from one state to another is like driving in Europe from one country to another

            • Embikay says:

              “…. this does not mean that God is “That There” and we are here, nope God is everything just that our 5 senses can’t perceive more than that …” , you say. In doing so you unwittingly or otherwise state the Vedic truth of the Vedanta, (wit-end, literally, Veda-ant(a) being a compound word in Sanskrit cognae with Latin wit end), (incidentally the tradition I happen to come from, not however I have imbibed my inheritance, though.) I AM OF THE CONVICTION THAT THERE WAS VEDA, WITH ITS VEDANTA WISDOM, IN EONIC PERIODS, FOR all THE WORLD. And much else, in the names of Islam, Judaism, Christianity, and further, with their various sects, adopted the same philosophical thinking, to weave their fables in order to popularise it through their religious symbols of place for worship, practices like festivals/ holy days, etc. Or else, such identical philosophy, or god- and self- oriented thinking will not find such ready echo. Erwin Schrodinger, Nobel physicist, was greatly attracted by Vedanta, due the ubiquitous and eternal presence of the Absolute Self which pervades as Universal Consciousness, which looked like an explanation of the behaviour in the particle world which defied conventional scientific methods of observation and measuring/ counting with adequately sophisticated instruments. Now, to end this for now, I wish to say that the Universal Consciousnes implies that man (like any other micro or macro cosmic material items) is a speck of the Divinity/ God , though this term is not to the looking of some scientists, is a speck of divinity, that is why he cannot rest idle, without thinking, at least at times, about Him (or That), either thrilling in Him or denying Him. In the Vedic religion of Hinduism, God is presumed and feelable and realizable by everone with faith, where Vedic philosophy has some exponents who interpret the Vedas as not necessarily theistic all the time, since they do not contradict an impersonal, quality-less, attributeless, formless entity operating with a super-intelligence. The question whether That resides outside/inside, hither/ thither, has been answered in the Vedanta, as all of it, and none of it, leaving open for ever, the question for man to strive independently and striving hard, through study, reflection and approaching certified (or other) authorities who propagate the Vedas, and test them for evolving conviction through self-experience. Indeed real Hinduism reveres Atheists since without them theism will have become just a fad, meaning, anyone joins the bandwagon of theism, without really working to realise the truth of it. Once the authority of the statement of Universal Consciousness is accepted, it follows that differences between you and me, this and that, vanish, and hence, there is no fear, and there is all love, and only love. Thus, incidentally, the Vedic truth of love rooted in fearlessness is very much the same as what Christianity emphasises as one of its preoccupations in its propaganda. I end there. Not forgetting my promise to end there, for now. Thanks and kind regards. For your kind consideration.

        • Richard says:


          Its the same concept most of the European Union countries join the union for either wealth and/or military protection which is like reverse psychology of an invisible sword. Many of the countries back then joined some of the old Empires for protection as well to end war with a more powerful states, and/or to gain wealth privileges. The only differences today war is more mental, If I got the weapon, and wealth supply I can coerce you to join me, or be dominate either or.

          It is a better concept that create less bloodshed, but the people of your country is not exempt from starvation which happens to kill as well if your not accepted as you tried your best to join in like you said in order to get them billions euros in help. In a great union countries would not have to fight to join they would be welcome and accepted since the main idea is to unite and help. Turkey would love to join because they can really use that help. Also if you are in a position to help why make it difficult for those who are begging for help, a selective help.

          Oh yes I believe in all great minds including my own, but I got your point, I hope you get mine.

          Trust me the word “Rich” is known everywhere I don’t know in which world you are living in.

          • Tavi says:


            What are you talking about? The European Union countries joined the union for “military protection”? The Red Bear Soviet Union’s Era vanished into oblivion, so those countries are afraid from whom? Joining the Union for Wealth yes :), one life we live and we all deserve a decent life, and I’m not sure if you agree with that.

            “In a great union countries would not have to fight to join they would be welcome and accepted since the main idea is to unite and help” … Well, are you talking of a Star Trek like society?…well, way to go, I remember when I was behind the Iron Curtain and we all were wondering why the Americans don’t come to “save” us from communists. I guess each country has to “prove” from inside that they really want that change, and all those countries like Poland, Bulgaria, Romania, etc proved it in 1989. I guess the same thing happens in Iran right now when the oppressed people are fed up with Ahmadinejad and they clashed with police and set up barricades of burning tires when the president was re-elected.

            I believe there is such thing as “Natural Selection” for the future of Mankind Evolution that’s why we had those societies in the past that did not work: Sclavagism vanished, Feudalism vanished, Communism vanished (well almost…there are still a couple of “Our Dear Leader”…), etc.

            You said, “Trust me the word “Rich” is known everywhere I don’t know in which world you are living in”. . . Of course I knew that the word “Rich” is known everywhere, I was just playing with you! … It is Madoff’s nick name, isn’t it? I guess this name is a part of the Mankind Evolution too 🙂

            Anyway there is a lot of truth in what you said, there’s no doubt about that. Still if you are in a position to help others (I am reffering to your statement “why make it difficult for those who are begging for help”), then you do not want to do it in a “Food Stamps or Public Aid” way to get them off your shoulders… I am sure you agree at least with this one…and yes I enjoyed your messages.

            • Rich G says:

              “What are you talking about? The European Union countries joined the union for “military protection”? The Red Bear Soviet Union’s Era vanished into oblivion”

              Not so fast my friend, most of these countries joined for military protection. Although the Soviet Union’s Era non longer exist, however the Russian Federation does and some of these countries are afraid of it.
              Here is a clear example to support my statement, if Georgia was part of the European Union do you think Russia would have retaliate against it. I dont think so, they would have been diplomatic solution. So many of these countries are in the Union for the three Musketeer idea “one for all and all for one”

              Hell yeah I enjoyed your message, I am amazed listening to these people trying to proove god exist and the other proving god doesn’t. My answer is who cares either way god does answer my prayer at all or not fast enough, does not exist for me, and according to the definition of the word exist god does not exist anyways. LOL

              I love that idiom metaphor about the blind you said think its brilliant is it yours I would like to quote it sometime – Tavi. However, we still dont know for sure because we dont know what they are seeing. Its like the blind fighting for something they cant see, but we can’t say for sure they are wrong because we dont know what they are seeing, since what we see is more important to us than what we cant see.

              I know i have dream about thing from other planet that I have not seen on earth since it could be just my imagination it could be just their imagination. lol

              Yeah its so many Richard in this forum to, I had to go with Gate and Madoff nickname Rich although I am far from the pitch.

          • Tavi says:

            A while ago you said that you could write a story about a man or woman that might surpass Christ goodness, just for the hack of it write please a couple of sentences about that in here, how would you envision that…and why would you do that?
            The metaphor about the blind is mine, like everything I wrote in here, yes you can quote it if you ever want, and Octavian is my name…Tavi is my nick name. There is no doubt that a blind develop the other 4 senses more to compensate, still there is no comparison, I mean 4 sense will always be less than 5, and I dare to imagine how would be having 6, or 7 or more senses, and the right training and understating for that. Talking about your dreams, I believe that some of our dreams are “prophetic” dreams, others are just dreams and I believe you just “know” which one are the prophetic dreams.

            I loved Perry’s video and especially that about chromosomes, genes etc; I read somewhere that monkeys chromosomes are almost similar with our chromosomes …the difference is only 1 percent, but that 1 percent gave us Mozart, Einstein, the Beatles etc. Because of that positive changes in the chromosomes, I speculate that in the future the humans would evolve in a geometrical progression so much that they would be able to walk on water at will, like it happened 2000 years ago… but then others would be even more
            Like Perry I do not believe in infinite number of Universes and my point of view is because mathematically speaking this is impossible, I mean infinite plus one is infinite, infinite times infinite is also infinite, infinite at the power infinite is also infinite, therefore it is only one Universe, this Universe. I do not believe in reincarnation simply because I do not see the reason of it, I mean would you go back to Elementary School, High School once you experienced that? I believe that all the glory is here, the past, present and the future just that our limited senses allow us to see just the daily slices from the whole…in a forward direction. It is said that the tachyons can travel into the future present and past (at least the math equations proved theoretically that), so the Science Fiction and the Science start to merge!

      • Forrest Charnock says:

        To try and say that Jesus Christ did not exist or did not die on a Roman cross 2000 years ago is intellectually schizophrenic.
        No one would remember your story 3 years from now, much less 3000.
        I think your desire to not believe in God has clouded your judgment.

  7. ario says:

    If available to send these partes of “Where did the universe come from” by arabic language?

  8. Juan says:

    How would you explain a God, a God for crying out loud, that can think of a world and create it! That can destroy and create matter with the single thought of it! That controls every fundamental force!

    Humans have always wanted to believe in a ‘God’, to explain everything they can’t: the rain, the sun, the moon. Each step science makes, and God starts fading away. Now God is related with the Big Bang, and the unexplainable, for now.

    Do you think Egyptians were right in thinking what they thought? Asigning a God to almost everything? Probably not. In 2000 years, people will say: 2000 years ago, people believed a God planned and created and destroyed everything, with infinite power! And people will laugh.

    • Kurt says:

      I believe the Bible was the first Scientific Theory of the Universe. Man looked around at the evidence he (or she!) knew of and came to a logical conclusion. “He” passed this wisdom along in the form of stories (no written word existed at the time). To debate Bible vs. Science is to debate old theory versus new. The Static Universe theory was shown to be imprecise so why not move on from the first guess? Non of this disproves God. Just means we are slow to understand something WAY beyond our current capabilities. Nothing wrong with that, we are trying!

      • Ben says:

        Kurt, aren’t you ignoring the vast swathes of religious literature that existed before the Bible? I’m sure the Greeks, Romans, Egyptians, Babylonians etc would all say they had looked at the evidence around them and come to a logical conclusion about its creation.

        What makes us different is that you are taking the Bible as your evidence and coming to a logical conclusion, whereas I and other scientists try and take into account everything before and since.

        • Kgajjar says:

          I do not understand the fact that everyone pro-god in emphasizing on the fact that god created us? If he is soo powerful and so great why does he have to go through all this pain of creating anything at all? Why can’t he just sit and enjoy himself. I do not mean to sound childish or insulting, although it seems as if a lot of people a inclined on believing that god HAS to create something.

          • Tavi says:

            Kgajjar, according to a widely spread belief God is Alpha and Omega, I mean the Beginning and the Perfection, and because our limited five senses and the three dimensional space we experience God as “slices” day by day in one forward direction; Ten thousand years from now the Mankind will experience God differently than we do it now, or we did it 2000 years ago… I do not mean to sound childish or insulting but I believe that God had to create something otherwise we wouldn’t be able to evolve from Nothing in to Something.

            I believe God is a One Super-dimension that is projected onto Sub-dimensions. If we consider a two dimensional World (the shadows of the objects or the shadows of our bodies for example) and compare it to our 3D space we can perceive the difference as being exponential. If we add one more dimension to our Space and time continuum then the difference must be exponential too…; thinking this way it is easer to understand the projection of the expression of God’s consciousness in our Space time continuum. Saying that the seeds of the Galaxies formation were formed prior to the Big Bang (from that dimensionless dot with infinite mass named Singularity), it is analog to saying that this Universe is the projection of a Hyper Universe and we perceive just a little bit from something by far more complex and different than we dare to think it is, I believe the Bible names that Hyper dimensional space as being the Heaven in a way to be understood by the people from that society 2000 years ago. If we would live in a Flat World then the scientists would express the height of a cube in their 2D flat surface as having an angle less than 90 degrees and that would be the only representation they would imagine about our 3D Space…but hey, we know that there is so much more…exponential! The scientists from our 3D World can express the geometry of a cube in a Hyper dimensional World (they named that cube Tesseract or Octachoron). That additional dimension would allow anybody from that hyper dimensional space to see the cube in the past, present and future …at once! But because our World with its limited 3 dimensions can’t allow that “geometry”, the scientists built a smaller cube inside a bigger one and they told us that the smaller cube has the same dimensions like the bigger one…just that it is seen in the past, and the lines that unite the corners of both cubes have in reality a right angle in that hyper space …yeah everything there is “magic”…beyond our comprehension, beyond our laws of physics…hmmmm!

            What I am trying to say is that there is no excuse not to believe in God, or the fact that God has to create something. By the way I do not understand why did you write God with “g” in a lower case, is it because you despite the rest of us…or because your English is your second language like mine and it is reflected in your grammar too? 🙂

  9. Lex says:

    If there is God, why is it that He allows us to suffer?

    • Kurt says:

      I believe we do have an immortal soul that is indestructible. So why should God care if we suffer? it is sorta like your old car in the junkyard wondering “why did they run that stop sign and leave me here?” You have a new car now and hopefully your a better driver now because of it. Why doesn’t God answer our prayers? Its the same reason we don’t let our kids call from school and give them the answers to the math quiz they are taking. You have to learn it to understand it.

      • Venugopal says:

        As long as humanity exists, people will believe in a God.
        There will be also people who do not believe in God.
        It is actually our inflated ego, which makes us think, that
        with our tiny intellect,. we can comprehend God completely.
        God is beyond human logic and science.

        • Kurt says:

          an infinitely intelligent being doesn’t NEED us to believe in it. Albert Einstein didn’t need others to believe in his theory. It would be like Einstein going to the poor uneducated people and insisting they understand. A smart person wouldn’t do that. In time they will, until then they must learn the lessons they are destined for.
          It doesn’t matter what an ant thinks, a kind person will just let them be and let them do their thing and not make up a thousand rules for them to live by. Religion is MAN made.

          • Abiiba TJ says:

            May God bless you abundantly for this comment. I thought I was the only one that thinks religion is manmade. God is not religion and religion is not God. If anyone is talking about God and Science, let the person first of all realise that God is mystery and a spirit, Science is the knowledge about the structure and behaviour of the natural and physical world based on facts that can be proven by experiments. These experiments are carried out by natural and physical materials. How do you expect to discover spiritual things with physical things? All our scientists will continue to base their experiments on things they can see, hear, feel, taste and smell but God only allows humans to perceive him with these senses when he chooses to. Maybe scientists have seen somebody performing the act of magic; do they have explanation for that? There is even a superior one which is called Miracle, where someone covered with leprosy is healed on the spot, is there an explanation? My sincere scientists, if there are explanations, don’t keep it to yourselves; please do share them with me.

          • Qqccho says:

            Hi Kurt again,
            I thought from your last entry that you were a religious person…”I do believe we have an immortal and indestructible soul”. I believe that kind persons do not need “future” better life to live therefore no new cars or souls are required. I also think that religion is man made- Soul was man creation.

            • Hugh Waters says:

              Indeed no doubt religion is man-made and soul is man’s creation.
              And even God was human creation too … for there is no God without humanity.

              What human motivated to do was to implement “Morality Law”

              Should laws of morality be observe and followed, a giver was required in order to be authenticated for universal adherence and acceptance. God was created by mankind through their image on thus stages based on myth, dreams and visions as Projected Giver of Morality Laws. Rules in formed of cult-dogma were designed fitted with anathema and rigorous physical implementation of the dominant leaders. Those were the survival of the fittest … and only individuals adhered to the rules of God were fitted to live and to join the new human society.

            • Hugh Waters says:

              And Kurt, to quote my friend on how God came about …

              God should have the qualities that Man doesn’t possess . . . qualities that Man himself knows he cannot have . . .omnipotence, omniscience etc.
              Man dies. But he fears death and wants to live longer, he then created God in order for him to look up to something after death. God now is immortal.
              Man cannot do everything. He feels inadequate he cannot fulfill bigger tasks, he then created God so that he can let God do the ‘impossible’ things for him. God now is omnipotent.
              Man (so far) cannot understand everything. He thinks he cannot explain everything around him, he then created God so that he can get short-cut answers to his inquiries. God now is omniscient.
              Man is alone. He distrusts his fellow for they’ve done awful things to him, he then made God his companion and he won’t be needing anyone anymore. He also wants God to watch over him wherever he is. God now is selfless and omnipresent.
              God is Man’s model. It has become so powerful that he fears his creation already. So in order for him to get everybody else to appreciate his creation, God had ‘perfect human qualities’ — sincere, loving, faithful etc. No one should want to praise a frightening God right? Now it has become Man’s perfect model to emulate.
              God is the manifestation of Man’s need for perfection. He created God to compensate his flaws.

      • Sticklix says:

        You know what ,whether you will belive this or not is your choice but this is what i belive: i am a christian and many people are and the most common question that is asked is :”if God exists, why do we have to suffer or why does He allow us to suffer?’ its not the fact that God allows us to suffer, its the mere fact that we cause the suffering on ourselves. I believe God created man and the universe and He created man with a free will wich means He does’nt force himself on people and people choose their own paths to walk and their own lives to live. God gives a choice whether we will serve Him or live our own lives and that brings me to my point, if we reject God and refuse to honour Him and make wrong choices we obveously will suffer the consequences of our actions.
        we cant expect for God to even answer our prayers when We cant even acknowledge Him. its like a basic relationship, if you are in a relationship with someone you talk to that person and communicate and have fun and you are willing to do anything for that person maby even die for that person depending on your love for that person, this mere fact works the same with God you dont want anything to do with God but yet when something bad happens then you blame it on God yet you refuse Him. how on earth do you expect Him to answer your prayers you are not even in a relationship with Him. the only way is to realise what you are doing and ask God to forgive you and accept His Son Jesus and choose to serve God with all your heart and choose to live a life for God. God does not want anyone to suffer He loves everyone very much, but unless we all make that choice to follow Christ it will seem as if we are suffering.

      • Qqccho says:

        Hi Kurt,
        In this website we’ve been reading about proves, evidences and theories. This website has been all the time asking to prove this or that. I’ll go same way asking; give us an evidence that soul exits. It was painful to read “why should God care if we suffer? We humans rather imperfect suffer a lot when we see others suffering. Are we better than Him in this aspect? In any case, why did He create us then in the first place? It was either painful to compare Man with an old needless car saying that you have to go through the dieying process to have a new one- something that you don’t know for sure. Are we better off dead? And yes nobody will blow in your ears the answers to your math test because is unfair. Same way the Creator won’t speak answering to your prayers because good people have nothing to ask for.

    • Vasko says:

      For fun – HE has the same sense of humor most people have

    • Forrest Charnock says:

      My advice is to read his book!
      Sadly few believe His word is true , as written. In Genesis He tells of of a perfect creation marred by sin. We are responsible for death and suffering, He allowed us to choose because He wants to be loved like we want our children to love us.
      If He wanted robots He would have made robots. Adam was told what the consequences of sin were but disobeyed anyway. God loved us so much He knew before He created us His only son would be tortured and nailed to a cross for our transgressions and yet made us anyway.
      Sadly the herd mentality has caused many Christians to decide what parts of the Bin;e are true and intelligent people realize if the first verse is wrong there is not much point in reading the second.
      I will be shocked if this is posted as being a believer is now considered just above a child molester in today’s society.

      May God have mercy on us!

      • Qqccho says:

        Who sinned the first as Bible claims? One of God’s main angels sitting by his side; Satan by the way. So first Sin was commited in heavens before Cosmos Creation took place. God’s place and population were created first. Then after creation satan was sent to earth- to help us sin? Good move.
        If even His angels- one third of them + Satan were capable of producing a coop or insurrection in heavens even before anything, then we have a precedent; we and some of His angels were created imperfect. Didn’t the Bible mention that “we were created at His image and….”? So how come we end up imperfect and require religion to “save our souls”. Are we responsible for death and suffering?
        How come Satan deceived Eve promissing eternal live if she and Adan already had it as first indicated by God?
        This topic has nothing to do with this webpage issues. I just wanted to give my thoughts to Forrest.

    • Dina says:

      I can see at least three reasons:
      1) Our sufferings are nothing to compare to the sufferings of Jesus Christ;
      2) God teaches us to the better understanding of sufferings of other people
      3) May be He prepares us to be ready for greater sufferings in future.

  10. Tavi says:

    I watched your video about “God – an intelligent design and implementation” and it was very well done, I liked it. I do believe in an intelligent design and implementation of the Universe and the Mankind. I think everything is already there, around us, I mean the past, the present, the future just that we can not see it because some of our senses are not yet fully developed, though we are aware of it, therefor we use the religion and science to express it. In your video you talked about genes, chromosomes, DNA etc, maybe someday we will perceive more then we do right now, I mean someone who is blind can’t see the world like the rest of us, though he can think that it could be more than he can perceive. Because the space time continuum and our limited senses we can see our lives only as slices of the whole. If we add one more dimension to the space time continuum than we can see the beginning and the end of us and everything in between…and much more. Did we all come from Heaven? Yes it is possible, the so called Singularity, that dot with no dimensions and infinite mass that generated the Big Bang could be the Biblical Heaven and our Universe is just the representation of that hyper dimension in our three dimensional space….like our two dimensional shadows in the light is our 3D projection on the ground . The Universe did not expand from an infinitesimal point to whatever it is right now; it was bigger from the beginning, like I explained above. I tried to put on my computer monitor “canvas” our hyper dimensional origin that most of us name it God. In my Art Work symbolically I used the so called Octachoron (tesseract) as the singularity (the hyper dimension). Please look at my artwork “The Creation of Peace”, and “Our hyper dimensional origins” http://www.myspace.com/octavian7 Your video is perfect and it proves that we are the projection of something from a hyper dimension point of view… Do we have access to more then our six senses? I think all of us have access just that we are not aware of that. Here is one of my experiences http://mindscape777.blogspot.com Thanks for your one hour video I enjoyed it. Peace and Love, Tavi (Octavian)

  11. Roman says:

    I wonder if this Universe is really balanced? – sometimes I use to think of it as an endless doomed being forging his death (well, if I adopt ID, we all are designed to die).- Maybe our perception of time makes us think it is balanced, and by using another time scale it has a very short (or long ad devia infinitum) life, and maybe very gray end…
    I dont know.
    I read some of your posts, and it makes me think: it is the zeitgeist. I also have an IT degree and see the world through eyes that I was given, and I guess I understand your design, because I was taught a similar language. I wish you luck with your message [luck in terms of ID, so if you are right you will succeed].

  12. May says:


    I am so enjoying your writings and look forward to receiving them each day. You are explaining everything in a way that all can understand. So often it is difficult to interpret clearly what the writer is saying, but you don’t fall into that category. Thank you so much.

    • Tavi says:

      Perry, I think the merit is all yours…. you started it this awesome subject; And I can tell you that because of you I know now more about DNA than long before, when I was in the HS 🙂 thanks Tavi

  13. David says:

    Love your clear explanations and thoughts. As a member of a Christian church,the Mormons, your thoughts are very much in line with our teachings. The founder , Joseph Smith, taught that matter is eternal ,co-eternal with God and that it could not be created notr destroyed.(as Einstein said much later) . I guess the key is that matter is eternal and God is not it’s creator but it’s organizer. The creation in the Bible is not from nothing but from unorganized matter to organized. It’s from inanimate to animate. The incredible thing is that Joseph had these ideas in the early 1800’s. I guess it’s not so incredible because he felt it to be God’s,intelligence,God’s inspiration and direction over many years. There is more but these are the basics. Again , keep your emails coming.

    • David,

      Genesis 1:1 says, “In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.” I have a hard time envisioning a clearer statement that God preceded matter.

      I mean no disrespect to you personally, but this is one of the reasons I don’t embrace some of the LDS teachings.


      • Dave says:


        Genesis 1:1 might say “God created the heavens and the earth”, but “God” didn’t say it, whoever wrote the that passage originally and then was modified by another author at the request/direction of a pagan Roman emperor at Nicea in the 4th century C.E. did.

        What does that “prove”, except you base your Faith upon it? Certainly, the author(s) of the bible were not around at the time of life starting on earth. ALL “Faith” is based upon belief in ancient creation myths.

        All of your Judeo-Christian myths are lingering, distorted memories of myths of the Sumerian, Indian and Egyptian cultures. Or maybe even earlier, forgotten and lost cultures.

        That’s an obvious FACT you choose to ignore.

        You have Faith, good for you. You should not attempt to inject some fantasy of reality into myth. That is not the purpose of religion: to prove Myth. It is to make you a better spiritual person. A moral, compassionate soul.

        Atheists can also enjoy spirituality, without embracing myth as fact, which it clearly is not.

        • Dave,

          The dead sea scrolls proved that the Old Testament was not written by Constantine at Nicea.

          That is the only factual statement you have made, and it is factually wrong.

          As for the rest – you’ll need to take your tirades about religion elsewhere.


          • Zippy Karakurt Ozman says:

            Dave, you do not believe to God’s Words because you were not present at the time of Jesus. Well, this is a stale argument isn’t it? None of US live longer than at most 100 years nowadays, your Joseph Smith guy was not living in year 1800, was he? So how can you refer to the disorganised matter by using the same resources………… in your language it is hearsay…….

            I do know that Jesus is with US at all times……. One can only speak about their own experiences. I was born as a muslim girl in the city where Constantine started the Christianity, or let us put it more correctly, Constantine chose my city as the first Christian Capital in 330 A.D. namely Constantinoples ( we call it now Istanbul) now I am a devout Christian, because in the 21st Century Christ made a contact and He promised me to answer all my questions….. He also told me that (telephatically) His mechanism was much much simpler than most humans thought.

            I am reading Perry’s DNA code and its alphabet consisting of 4 letters, with great interest…… I believe that we are all born with a purpose and plan and they are all in our DNA’s…….We cannot work our future out yet, but I believe with people like Perry(s help, we will be able to facilitate our learning process.

            I do not know anything about Physics, I studied law in Istanbul, my Turkish is powerful, English is my second language…….. which means I am suffering a lot whilst trying to follow and understand all these wonderful teachings in my second language. Yet, I am most grateful to God and to His hardworking friendly children who help me to understand and learn God’s Mind and Technics… You have to learn to understand……

            You have to learn to trust. Jesus would not tell you lies.

            I had read somewhere once that we all have genes in our bodies represent faith……. It did make perfect sense to my inquisitive mind, since I can start seeing God’s mechanism……. We are all a small part of God. God created US in His own image and gave US the power to rule the World……. With this power in our hands, we have to protect all the organic and inorganic matters around US. They are also God’s creation.

            Talk to you later.

    • Jim R says:

      The Mormon scriptures the universe (and earth) are created within space and time – quite the opposite of the scriptures that has God creating the universe/earth with its space-time dimensions. I’ve heard (but not verified) that that is one reason that there are so few LDS astronomers.

    • Ben says:

      But we KNOW that matter can be created and destroyed. It’s been done. Famously so at the end of the World War II.

  14. Igor says:


    So in this email, you talked about ‘dark energy’ and an ‘external agent’. Are you implying that maybe ‘dark energy’ is God? Or maybe you mean God used ‘dark energy’ in the process of the Universe coming into existence. Just a question, I got the point of your mail but please answer this question.

    • No one is saying that this dark energy term is “God.” Rather that the extremely fine balances of forces strongly suggests design, not something haphazard.

  15. Pete says:

    Please don’t take my arguments as the rantings of an atheist as I am not. I have enjoyed your emails and look forward to the next two. I simply desire proof not conjecture. I truly would love for you to prove for me that God exists. I have simply lost all faith.

  16. Saiel says:

    If there are infinite universes,WHAT ARE THEY CONTAINED IN? As we know the only universe “in which we live” can be thought to be like a balloon that’s inflated and is been positively expanding.

  17. Shawn says:

    “never even form a single star”

    Well, He could of done a better job because most (95%) of the “normal” baryonic matter in the Universe is in the form of multi-million-degree “hot cluster gas” that forms an intergalactic medium in clusters of galaxies. So in the Universe as a whole, there is 20 times as much hot intergalactic plasma as there are stars.

  18. hashim says:

    dear sir marshal
    i love to know about you
    any biography for u sir

  19. Denzil Hiripitiyage says:

    Dear Perry,

    I want to ask you a simple question. Where was the creator befor ‘Big Bang ‘ occured? Creator also came to exsistance after ‘Big Bang’ or he was there before it happened? If so where was he?

    Hope this is a respectful question!

  20. Tyler says:

    This is all very interesting, but still no one can prove god. When it comes down to it, no one knows. Saying “god is everywhere” is not science. Science cannot prove god

    • David says:

      However, as it is written,
      “… since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.”

    • Alyssa says:

      i think the question isnt if there is a god or not.

      i think the question is What is God?
      what do you, i, or anyone mean, when we say God ?

      some will answer energy, some will answer a higher consciousness, everyone will probably answer a bit different. some believe they know for sure. those people, i believe, are the ones who are in trouble …….

      🙂 Jah Bless

      • Forrest Charnock says:

        The ones in trouble are the ones so enamored with human reasoning they refuse to bow the knee to their creator and savior Jesus Christ.

        • Alyssa says:

          apologies for using the phrase ‘in trouble’ .
          we all have our beliefs, our understandings, our views. they are all valid.

          without human reasoning, where would we be ?

          as my cousin an atheist said to me last night, ‘it really doesnt matter at the end of the day.’ which ill agree with. whether or not theres a higher consciousness does not solve what we are going to do tomorrow. it does not tell us what we want to study, or help us forge relationships with loved ones. it definitely doesnt create [world] peace (the knowledge), and it doesnt cure disease. it doesnt build homes, or computers, and it doesnt make food appear.
          i believe that thats our job – right here – now –

          as for submission, personally i dont enjoy praise- inflation of ego- therefore why would i think that a higher consciousness would? recognition is great. respect is wonderful. love possibly perfect. but submission? fear?
          those to me seem unnecessary, illogical, and somehow outdated.

          • Forrest Charnock says:

            Human reasoning has given us eugenics, the threat of nuclear war all sorts of very bad things.
            Your cousin the atheist might want to ask himself/herself what human reasoning has done for science, real science, the kind that gives us scientific laws and computers , the germ theory of disease ,genetics , biology etc.?
            All of these science were made possible by the assumption that the creator God of the Bible does in fact exist and gave us the laws of nature and a logical mind to search for them. If atheism was correct how could we know ? In a materialistic universe there is no reason for natural laws such as the laws of logic to exist.

            History shows us that no atheist/evolutionists ever founded a natural law or a major branch of science , and most of history’s greatest inventions were the brainchild of those who accept the creator God of the Bible. There are no coincidences that big.!

            In all living systems there is encyclopedic volumes of specific, purposeful, and goal oriented information written is the biotic code.

            Codes are not material entities and neither is information. Codes cannot arise by themselves from matter , information cannot arise by itself from matter,
            And matter cannot create intelligence . All these things are scientifically impossible yet it is absolutely necessary that they are true if evolution/atheism is true.
            The most basic cell imaginable had to be programmed with at least an encyclopedias worth of information and possibly libraries full, we are still in the infant stages of modern biology and just don’t know yet. What we do know is that information had to pre-exist the cell and the intelligence that created it was by definition supernatural. An intelligence beyond human imagination designed and created the system , not some vague pantheistic god consciousness. The only logical candidate is the God of the Hebrews, the God of the Bible.

            • Alyssa says:

              Human reasoning is what led to the liberation of africa americans who began to awake and realize their personal rights. Human reasoning also led women to realize that they, too, should have the right to vote, etc.
              Human reasoning led to evolution, led to shelter…
              Human reasoning is now leading to many other things, such as animal rights and more sustainable technologies that are not damaging to Earth.

              i repeat; without human reasoning, where would we be ?

              my cousin believes in science. she simply doesnt want to think about the Creator. that is her choice. as for us, we do not disagree on much. the God of the Hebrews, the God of the Bible, the God of the Mormons, the God of the Muslims, the God of the Buddhists, God is One.
              Every civilization has developed their own understanding of God and they are all valid. not just YHVH.
              God speaks to people all the time. if only we speak to him directly, he answers. ‘it’ Guides. and speaks. in its own way.
              so the recounting of experiences in which God spoke to Moses is just as legitimate as when God speaks to any of us.
              i believe that that is what science is missing, and is coming to. a personal relationship with the Divine, with each of our personal and collective Creator — that takes work and love, and listening to. a two way relationship.

              Jah Bless ~~

              • Venugopal says:

                Dear Alyssa,
                I am paraphrasing Mahatma Gandhi : ” People have become so dense, they are unable to understand the symbols send by God for them. God is continuously sending messages to people in the form of symbols.”

              • Tavi says:

                Hi Alyssa,
                Human reasoning led to evolution? Your cousin does not want to thing about the Creator? Well please tell her to read many of the ancient books, or Iliad and Odyssey and she’ll see that the heroes did not have reasoning, the Gods told them what to do, although the humans populated the Earth for thousands and thousands of years. Athena told Ulysses to build the Trojan horse, Aphrodite thought Paris to kidnap Helen; virtually there was nothing the humans could do without the Divine’s help, the humans were not capable to “think” and do things by themselves. Then the Gods stopped to “help” the humans and let themselves develop their own reasoning … and we got the Dark Ages, I believe that we are approaching a time when the Divine’s help comes again and melt with our own developed reasoning and the result will be a constructive own, beyond any imagination.

                Tell your cousin that from nothing it’s impossible to “evolve” into something, there was needed a Divine Power beyond any understanding for that to happen, and most of us name this Divine Power as being God. Your cousin will never be able to explain me how we evolved from nothing into something, unless she proves me that it always been the first atom, or molecule or cell that replicated and gave us the microorganisms etc until we got the life as we know it in the present day. Don’t let her being fooled by non-believers or those who use(d) the religion for politics reasons, rather tell her to walk Einstein’s side of the street because Einstein believed in God. You know when Science and Religion go hand in hand the result are Blessings, when the Politics go hand in hand with the Religion the results are Tragedies.

                The only way to have this Universe as we know it, evolved from Nothing, is to see it as a One Super Dimension, and all the others Hyper Dimensions as being projected onto Sub-Dimensions, like the 2-D shadows are the projections of the 3-D objects onto a Flat World… so if we know that there are physically 2D and 3D dimensions then I’d say that it got to be more dimensions (talking about reasoning your chosen topic, and by the way I am a Romanian American so be good to my English style)just that our limited 5 senses can’t perceive all of them, like a blind can’t perceive the World like the rest of us do. GOD is everything, and please don’t let your cousin tell me that this affirmation is not a scientific one! Everything is here, Alfa and Omega, the Beginning and the Perfection of the already designed Evolution, just that we perceive this Evolution slice by slice only in one forward direction, because our limited five senses.

                Although we see discrepancy in the World, now in the beginning of the 3rd millennium, still overall we all are much better than the humans who lived centuries ago, and I strongly believe that we all are ready to embrace willingly the God’s Conciseness in our developed reasoning and that will bring us to a 3rd stage of the Human Race “designed” Evolution. I put this “reasoning” on a canvas and named it One Super Dimension (you’ll see a pear of sunglasses in a Cathedral, and much more). Virtually all my four Art Works have the same common denumerator God being the Creator, there is no other way to explain the Evolution unless you are a Super Robot, no matter how much we will try to reject this truth we will come back and loosen ourselves because this truth is embodied in our genes and for the moment we kind of feel overwhelmed by its magnitude. Please tell your cousin not to be afraid of opening her soul not only her mind, we all try to loosen ourselves little by little and embrace the Truth no matter how more or less educated we are.

                Here are my Art Works on MySpace.com about “Evolution” and if you or your cousin ever want to look at them then here you are (under the Pics) http://www.myspace.com/octavian7 Have you and your cousin a great life, Tavi (Octavian)

              • Forrest Charnock says:

                If your read the history books slavery was ended by conservative Christians such as William Wilberforce , they were called the abolitionists. Black people did not decide all the sudden to think for themselves and desire freedom, they always did think for themselves and desire freedom. .

                Never before had slavery been abolished to such a great extent in all of human history. There was a great struggle for equality that took another 140 years or so but it all started with Christians who held God’s word to be true that we are all one blood, equal in the sight of God. The God of the Hebrews, of Issac and Jacob, not some New Age god consciousness

                The human reasoning of evolution led to evolutionary Eugenics and the greatest slaughter in human history. It has lead to the moral decay of the west , the murder of the unborn, the breakup of the family , and the rise of Totalitarian Marxist governments. Human reasoning will be the death of civilization.

                • irshad says:

                  I would like to add this view on evolution. It should be taken in context of what is happening in Europe around the same same time. It is end of the first and the start of the second industrial in Europe and the main requirements of industry are raw materials and markets. These raw materials and markets are in Asia and Africa The competing nations for these raw materials and markets are Germany, France and Great Britain. How do you convince a conservative Victorian society that it is alright to subjugate nations and rob them of their natural resources.Herbert Spencer a leading social scientist of the time peverts Darwin’s evolutionary theory to include not just compertion between species but intra species meaning tribe vs tribe, nations vs nations races vs races. He promotes the idea of a superior european race (Anglo Saxon) destined to better and civilize the savages of Asia and Africa. This will ligitimize the conquest nations in Asia and Africa by Germany, Britain and France eventually leading to the First World War to see who is the more superior European. Fighting in the trenches of this war is none other than Adolf Hitler, who in time will belive it is not just the ordinary european but the blond and blue eyed Aryan who is the master race. He will do the unthinkable and industrialise genocide and send millions of jews along with gypsies, homosexuals and people with disabilities to the ovens and take the world to the 2nd World War. Along with promoting the idea of natural selection we remove a God. By removing God there is no accountability of how we behave and treat our fellow man.

                • Qqccho says:

                  You’re not doing well your homework. Your words
                  “The human reasoning of evolution led to evolutionary Eugenics and the greatest slaughter in human history. It has lead to the moral decay of the west , the murder of the unborn, the breakup of the family , and the rise of Totalitarian Marxist governments. Human reasoning will be the death of civilization”.

                  You are on this world thanks to evolution and you’re parents. Or you believe that God himself came to put you here on this earth?. Your last sentence sends you to the age of caverns. Have you noticed that we are reasoning for centuries and still here? Perhaps you are not doing well, sorry. I see human reasoning where it should be at this point as Creator’s desire. Not only material things evolve Intelligence evolves too- Evolution was God’s greatest Tool. He created the means (codes) and let Creation to go all the way.

            • Qqccho says:

              Hi Forrest,
              The Creator created matter first- the first blow, and let the snow ball go down the slope. He knew sometime in future from that matter will come all living things. This has nothing to do with any science or believe. In any case if He wanted to do things this way, couldn’t He?

          • Forrest Charnock says:

            Dear Allyssa:

            I must disagree that all our views of origins are valid, that contradicts the law of non contradiction,so much for human reasoning.

            There can only be one correct view . I submit that anyone who believes there are many is not one who adheres to the true one.

            So called “toleration” is a curse that is destroying the greatest societies to ever inhabit the earth, the West.

            • alyssa says:

              wow. toleration is a negative thing? wow. how do i possibly react to such a statement.

              here are my beliefs, or findings, or realizations, that are also from me, also from intuition, also from the mind and heart and wisdom passed down from all over the world and many generations. take it as you will.

              we are all reflections of each other. what we are seeing is a manifestation of us. when we judge others we are judging ourselves
              we are all pieces of the same whole. this whole consists of everything imaginable and probably much more. we are all part of a oneness that is God, if you insist on calling it that. god is not a he or she- god is an it, encompassing both masculine and feminine aspects like us all.

              when we hurt another we are hurting ourselves
              we are all part of the same whole, can we comprehend it?

              the whole is god

              this is my understanding of life and of existance. and if you differ that is wonderful, and that is fine, for we are all granted our own existances and minds and hearts to do with them what we please, to enjoy the playground of life. there are no rules. we created the rules and we may break them and change them as we will. that may be a difficult statement for a scientist so please ignore it if you dont like it. or dont.
              i do not want to fight, and i dont want to debate. im simply letting you know how i feel, and how i see it.
              my views are equally valid to each of yours. and i love you all, by the way. and appreciate your depths and words and i thank you all.

              coexistance. peace. unity. respect. understanding. love. tolerance. these are things that resonate within Me.
              it is said that when the mind is running all too fast and we become confused, we should stop thinking, and we should begin to Feel again.


              • Forrest Charnock says:


                You have the right to be a pantheist as your views show you are and I have to tolerate that which means the same thing as tolerating pain..I don’t like pain, I wished it did not exist, but seeing as I cannot avoid it I tolerate it. But that does not mean I have to accept it. Your concept of God is the concept that held back science and human development. In your view of the universe their is no creator God therefore no reason to believe that the laws of science exist. If is an ancient and primitive view of the universe.

                If you stop and truly think about it if there is this so-called “god consciousness”
                , if this neo-pagan view is true, then we are forced to believe that everything created itself , that it evolved for no apparent reason and the information in living systems arose by itself from matter.

                There cannot be 2 truths so one of us is wrong or both. The idea of “toleration” in today’s world is that everybody has to compromise any conviction they have and be “open” to new ideas. It teaches religion is simply something you claim to follow, not something that is actually true.

                Christianity is not open to compromise as Jesus Christ said He was the way , the truth , and the life and no one comes to the father but by Him. There is only one way to heaven and many to hell. My belief is that their is only one true religion and it is Christianity, surprisingly people who preach “Toleration” are not “Tolerant” of my views at all.go figure?

              • Forrest Charnock says:

                Allysa said:

                “i do not want to fight, and i dont want to debate. im simply letting you know how i feel, and how i see it.
                my views are equally valid to each of yours. and i love you all, by the way. and appreciate your depths and words and i thank you all.

                coexistance. peace. unity. respect. understanding. love. tolerance. these are things that resonate within Me.
                it is said that when the mind is running all too fast and we become confused, we should stop thinking, and we should begin to Feel again.”

                The whole idea here is an exchange of ideas, to say you don’t want to debate means your views are emotional. No one should want to fight of course or take this personal.

                I disagree with a great deal of what Perry says and pretty much everything you say but I do not take that as a reason to like or not like anybody. I have a problem taking anyone serious who gives flowering speeches and then a disclaimer that objections are unwelcome.

                This “unity” you speak of could only be accomplished if no one actually takes what they believe as literally true, which I do ,so why would you want to be in unity with me? That would require you change your beliefs as I will not , I would prefer death.

                And yes I am commanded to love you as you are a child of the Most High whether you accept that or not and peace is something all men should strive for but for me to claim that conflicting beliefs are equally valid would be intellectually schizophrenic .


                • alyssa says:

                  the whole is god

                  god is the whole plus much more ~~

                  and in answer to anothers question of what is the name of God …
                  i say, ask God yourself.
                  develop the personal relationship that is available for us to open to…
                  God cannot be contained in letters words ideas forms . . .
                  God has many faces, Many Names . . .

                  • Forrest Charnock says:

                    Dear Allyssa:

                    Where did this idea that God has many faces come from? It certainly did not come from the Bible.

                • Leon says:

                  I have read a lot of all these pages.
                  All this arguments doesn’t mean anything.
                  The only thing that you have to believe in is GOD. That he is Almighty, the only Creator of all, and that he has died for our sins on the cross.

                  • Forrest Charnock says:

                    Dear leon:

                    It is true all you have to believe Jesus is God and died for your sins and ask Him to forgive your sins and save your soul. That being said it does not mean Biblical authority is irrelevant. The Bible says there are false conversions and if you have to say the Bible is wrong and that Jesus Christ was ignorant of “science” how sure can you be your belief is genuine?’If the Bible is wrong about creation why do believe Christ could turn water into wine and rise from the dead?

          • my middle name ann says:

            Isaiah 45:7 (King James Version)

            7I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

            • Forrest Charnock says:


              Please study the Bible and read some good books about it. I don’t really want to get into a lengthy discussion here about Old English but you are doing what evolutionists falsely accuse me of doing, quote mining. Doing it to God has grave consequences, unimaginable.
              The verse does not mean God is responsible for evil, we are. He created us and we choose to sin.

              The only reason all these “theories” have existed for thousands of years about millions of years and evolution is that men to try and con themselves into believing God has no right to judge them for their sins.

              Nothing Darwin taught was not taught at least 6 centuries before Christ was born and it amazes me that even though that is an easily verifiable fact of history so few grasp it.